Miss Manners
1 08 2007I was raised with what I believed to be really good manners. My mom insisted on it. I was the only 6 year old showing up to a slumber party with a 2-liter bottle of Coke because “you just can’t show up empty handed”. I was taught that a guy opens a door for you, out of respect, but I should hold the door for my elders as well as people entering a building after me. Just because you should. If I were to be lucky enough to find a guy that helps me on or off with my coat (and I am), then I should also grant him the same respect in the opportune moment. I’m pretty confident with my forks, salad and dinner, and I always “Yes ma’am, no ma’am,” “Yes sir, no sir,” and “Thank you” and “You’re welcome”.
All that being said, my boyfriend’s parents (and him, obviously) have very, what I would call, formal manners. They’ve got manners I’ve never even heard of, like the one suggesting you leave a fork in the floor of a restaurant if you’ve dropped it. That’s just crazy. My thirty-one year old boyfriend asked his mother if he could be excused from the table. Wow.
I’ve found myself very self-conscious and self-doubting in these situations. Heck, when we last had a meal with his father, I momentarily blanked on which fork was my salad fork! (Why you would need a huge fork for your salad, I don’t know, but still, I wasn’t sure.) Of course, one factor is that I so want them to like me, and they do. But I want them to keep liking me. Also of course, they are wonderful people and wouldn’t stop liking me if I ate my salad with the bread knife. Even so, its something that is interesting about his family.
I remember when we first started dating, being shocked as we sat down to dinner having him help me off with my coat and pull out my chair. Guys just don’t do that anymore, not many, at least. And even fewer still continue to do it well into a relationship, which he still does. On one of those first dates, being impressed by his perfect manners, I said, “Where in the world did you come from?”
Well, now I know.
you’re turning in to one of them. use the big fork for salads and the small for dinner!
I admire good manners and meeting man who practices good manners is a luxury! And, I’m sure you are putting your napkin in your lap as soon as you sit down at the table.
Who picks up a fork if it’s dropped at home and at when would the retrieval occur?
And what if you’re dining with someone with Parkinsons? ?
Would the danger presented by having a minefield of forks under your feet override this arcane need for pretending there are no forks on the floor?
I don’t know who is supposed to pick it up. The wait staff, I suppose. I’ve had someone else confirm this one, so its not some weird thing they made up. I’ve actually thought about buying a book about manners just to learn the obscure ones I haven’t learned yet. I guess I AM turning into one of them. And I thought I was bad to begin with, I mean, I DO always put my napkin in my lap. Heck, I put my napkin in my lap when I sit at my desk at work and have lunch!
I daresay that you’ve gotten this all sorted out by now, but the not picking the fork up in a restaurant thing is partially a safety issue. If you’re crawling around on the floor (or even just bending over) to retrieve a fork, you might be blocking travel paths through the restaurant. The staff would much rather you just sit there and then they can get the fork when they sweep later on.
The idea, as with most etiquette, is to reduce disruptions to the dining experience.
Have to wonder though, does he ask permission or just say something along the lines of “if you’ll excuse me for a moment?”
He actually says, “May I be excused?” And of course its all sorted out now (well, not that it ever wasn’t), but your suggestions makes sense regarding the safety issue. It was just one I’d never heard of! As I mentioned, most would believe I have pretty good manners (and for the record, his parents do too), I was just shocked at the level at which he carries day-to-day activities with pretty formal manners. I’m still impressed!
Dropped silver is picked up by the staff when they become aware it has fallen, to keep you from crawling on the floor and them from stepping on it or tripping on you. “Oh, dear, I dropped my knife” is sufficient in a private home, in which case the host/hostess will scoop it up and say, “Let me get you another,” and does so. No big deal. At a restaurant or at a home or club with staff, one signals a member of the wait or bussing staff, and says, “May I have another fork, please? I dropped mine,” and the staffer removes the dropped one and brings a new one immediately. No need to make a big deal of it here, either.
One normally says, “May I be excused,” to hostess or the senior lady present at any dinner — or the senior one in hearing range at a very large table, or the people in one’s immediate conversational group or “Excuse me, please,” to the table, generally, at a banquet with tables of 10 or so. Permission is ALWAYS given (you’re likely going to the WC, and since everyone knows that, there’s never a need to announce your purpose and it is in fact rude to do so).
It is also rude to discuss the food or what anyone in particular will or will not eat at table. It is permissible to say something is delicious. It is NOT permissible to push food on any or everyone or make anyone’s particular diet a subject of general conversation. The latter is particularly done to vegetarians. No matter what the diet or preferences, discussion thereof can make it impossible for others to enjoy the meal.
BUY and READ Miss Manner’s books! They work!
For the record, I understand manners very well, thank you and most would believe me to have impeccable ones.
I understand not using a dirty fork that has fallen on the floor of a restaurant. I just think it’s dangerous to leave an item of silverware in the floor (especially if there is hardwood; I’ve seen a spill at the Copper Cellar by someone stepping on silver left on the ground).
Most manners are to make sure that everyone is comfortable, regardless. I stnad by the notion that in SOME situations it would be much more polite to pick up the damn fork.